Bundy quote's
"It is not an easy matter to isolate things. I mean, incidents which themselves could cause pressure or stress, be unpleasant to one degree or another or have a disorienting effect. You have to see it in its unique effect on the unique individual. There are no broad generalizations or predictions you can make. You just can't predict behavior like that. Society wants to believe it can identify evil people ... it's not practical ... If someone does something antisocial and deviant, that is a manifestation of something that is going on inside. Once they do something, then they can be labeled. Predictions can't be made until that point is reached."
"I think that you could say that the influence of the person's family history was positive. But not positive enough -- not enduring, perhaps not strong enough to overcome the urges or compulsions that resulted ... in this instance, the influence of the family and the environment in which this person grew up were positive, but not so positive as to prepare this individual ... " "You take the individual we are talking about ... and then you subject him to stress. Stress happens to come randomly, but its effect on the personality is not random; it's specific. That results in a certain amount of chaos, confusion, and frustration. That person begins to seek out a target for his frustrations. The continued nature of this stress this person was under -- the nature of the flaw or weakness in his personality, together with other elements in the environment that offer him a logical target for his frustrations or escapes from reality -- yields the situation we're discussing ... There is no trigger, it is truly more sophisticated than that."
"I hate to use labels that are psychological or psychiatric because there are no stereotypes, and when you start to use those labels, you stop looking at the facts." "This condition is not immediately seen by the individual or identified as a serious problem. It sort of manifests itself in an interest concerning sexual behavior, as sexual images ... But this interest, for some unknown reason, becomes geared toward matters of a sexual nature that involves violence. I cannot emphasize enough the gradual development of this. It is not short term ... This is on a different level than this individual would deal with women every day, and not in the context of sexual condition, because that is over here someplace, like collecting stamps. He doesn't retain the taste of glue, so to speak, all day long. But in a broader, more abstract way, it begins to preoccupy him."
"He has no hatred for women; there is nothing in his background that happened that would indicate he has been abused by any females ... there is some kind of weakness that gives rise to this individual's interest in the kind of sexual activity involving violence that would gradually begin to absorb some of his fantasy ... he was not imagining himself actually doing these things, but he found gratification from reading about others so engaged. Eventually the interest would become so demanding toward new material that it could only be catered to by what he could find in the dirty book stores."
[Bundy described the part of "this personality" that found gratification in the thoughts, and later acts, of sexual violence as "the entity," "the disordered self," and "the malignancy." The schemes or ruses used for isolating and abducting his victims, were a result of fantasy, and attributed to the "Ted," or dominant part of the personality. The following are statements made by Ted in which he discusses the progressive pattern of sexual violence prior to the commission of murder.]
"Say he was walking down the street on one occasion, one evening, and just totally, by chance ... looked up into the window of a house and saw a woman undressing ... And he began, with some regularity, with increasing regularity, to, uh, canvass, as it were, the community he lived in. By peeping in windows, as it were, and watching a woman undress, or watching whatever could be seen, you know, during the evening, and approaching it almost like a project, throwing himself into it, literally for years ... These occasions when he when he would, uh, travel about the neighborhoods that adjoined his and search out candidates for ... search out places where ... he could see what he wanted to see ... more or less these occasions were dictated ... still being dictated by this person's normal life. So he wouldn't break a date or postpone an important, uh, event ... wouldn't rearrange his life ... to accommodate this, uh, indulgence in voyeuristic behavior ... He gained ... a great amount of gratification from it. And he became increasingly adept at it -- as anyone becomes adept at anything they do over and over and over again ... What began to happen was that ... important matters were not being rearranged or otherwise interfered with by this voyeuristic behavior, but with increasing regularity, things were postponed or otherwise rescheduled, to, uh, work around, uh, hours and hours spent on the street, at night and during the early morning hours."
" ... what's happening is that we're building up the condition ... and what may have been a predisposition for violence becomes a disposition. And as the condition develops and its purposes or its characteristics become more well defined, it begins to demand more time of the individual ... There's a certain amount of tension, uh, struggle, between the normal personality and this, this, uh, psychopathological, uh, entity ... The tension between normal individual, uh, normal consciousness of this individual and those demands being submitted to him via this competing ... this condition inside him seems to be competing for more attention ... And it's not an independent thing. One doesn't switch on and the other doesn't switch off. They're more or less active at the same time. Sometimes one is more active ... "
" ... a point would be reached where we'd had all of this, this reservoir of tension building. Building and building. Finally, inevitably, this force -- this entity -- would make a breakthrough ... Maybe not a major breakthrough, but a significant breakthrough would be achieved -- where the tension would be too great and the demands and expectations of this entity would reach a point where they just could not be controlled. And where the consequences would really be seen for the first time." " I think you could make a little more sense of it if you take into account the effect of alcohol. It's important ... When this person drank a good deal, his inhibitions were significantly diminished. He would find that his urge to engage in voyeuristic behavior on trips to the book store would become more prevalent, more urgent. On every occasion when he engaged in such behavior, he was intoxicated."
" ... On one particular evening, when he had been drinking a great deal ... and he was passing a bar, he saw a woman leaving the bar and walk up a fairly dark side street. And we'd say that for no ... the urge to do something to that person seized him -- in a way he'd never been affected before ... And it seized him strongly. And to the point where, uh, without giving a great deal of thought, he searched around for some instrumentality to uh, uh, attack this woman with. He found a piece of a two-by-four in a lot somewhere and proceeded to follow and track this girl ... and he reached the point where he was, uh, almost driven to do something -- there was really no control at this point ... the sort of revelation of that experience and the frenzied desire that seized him, uh, really seemed to usher in a new dimension to the, that part of himself that was obsessed with ... violence and women and sexual activity -- a composite kind of thing. Not terribly well defined, but more well defined as time went on."
"On succeeding evenings he began to, uh, scurry around this same neighborhood, obsessed with the image he'd seen on the evening before ... and on one particular occasion, he saw a woman park her car and walk up to her front door and fumble with her keys. He walked up behind her and struck her with a ... piece of wood that he was carrying. And she fell down and began screaming, and he panicked and ran. What he had done had ... purely terrified him ... The sobering effect of that was to ... for some time ... close up the cracks again. And not do anything. For the first time, he sat back and swore to himself that he wouldn't do something like that again ... or anything that would lead to it ... And he did everything he should have done. He stayed away from ... he did not go out at night. And when he was drinking, he stayed around friends. For a period of months, the enormity of what he did stuck with him, and he watched his behavior and reinforced the desire to overcome what he had begun to perceive were some problems that were probably more severe than he would have liked to believe they were ... within a matter of months ... the impact of this event lost its ... deterrent value. And within months he was back ... peeping in windows again and slipping into that old routine ... the repulsion began to recede ... something did stick with him. That was the incredible danger: by allowing himself to fall into spontaneous, unplanned acts of violence ... It took six months or so, until he back thinking of alternative means of engaging in similar activities, but not ... something that would be likely to result in apprehension."
"Then on another night he saw a woman walking home ... he followed her home ... Eventually, he created a plan where he would attack her in, in the house ... early one morning, uh, he sneaked into her house ... he jumped on the woman's bed and attempted to restrain her... all he succeeded in doing was waking her up, and, uh, causing her to panic and scream. He left very rapidly ... And then he was seized with the same kind of disgust, repulsion, and fear and wonder at why he was allowing himself to attempt such extraordinary violence ... But the significance ... was that while he did the same thing he did before -- stayed off the streets, vowed he'd never do it again and recognized the horror of what he'd done, and certainly was frightened by what he saw happening -- it only took him three months to get over it this time ... and then the next incident, he was over it in a month -- until it didn't take him any time at all to recover... "
"We are talking about anonymous, abstracted, living and breathing people ... but they were not known. To a point they were symbols, uh, but once a certain point in the encounter had been crossed, they ceased being individuals and became, uh, well you could say problems ... that's not the word either... that's when the rational self -- the normal self -- would surface and, and, react with fear and horror ... But, recognizing the state of affairs, would sort of conspire with this other part of himself to conceal the act. The survival took precedence over remorse ... the normal individual, began to condition mentally, out guilt out guilt; using a variety of mechanisms. Saying it was justifiable, it was, uh, acceptable, it was necessary, and on and on."
"He received no pleasure from harming or causing pain to the person he attacked. He received absolutely no gratification from causing pain and did everything possible, within reason -- considering the unreasonableness of the situation -- not to torture these individuals, at least not physically."
[The following are statements made by Ted concerning the abduction and murder of twenty-one year old college co-ed Lynda Healy, which occurred on January 31, 1974. Healy was vanish ed from the basement bedroom the home which she shared with several other students. More than year had passed before her remains were discovered, as were those of three other young women, scattered on the hillside of Taylor Mountain.]
" ... he checked out the house and found that the front door was open. He thought about it. What kind of opportunity that offered. And returned to the house later and entered the house ... Then he went around the house and found a particular door and opened -- really hit and miss. Not knowing who or what, not looking or anyone in particular ... that would be the opportunity. This was late at night. And presumably everyone would be asleep ... we know that sometime later the remains were found somewhere in the Cascades. So obviously she transported up there ... some place that was quiet and private. His home or some secluded area ... He would have the girl undress and then, with that part of himself gratified, he found himself in a position where he realized then he couldn't let the girl go. And at that point he would kill her and leave her body where he had taken her."
"As far as remorse over the act, that would last for a period of time. But it could all be justified. The person would attempt to justify it by saying, "Well, listen you, you fucked up this time, but you're never going to do it again. So let's just stay together, and it won't ever happen again." Why sacrifice this person's whole life ... But this did not last for very long. A matter of weeks. We go first into a state of semi-dormancy, and then it would sort of regenerate itself, in one form or another ... Once the condition began to reassert its force, it didn't look back. It looked forward. Didn't want to dwell on the preceding event, but begin to plan, anticipate, contemplate the next ... things would be learned. Experience teaches in overt and subtle ways. And over a period of time, there would be less panic, there would be less confusion, there would be less fear and apprehension. There would be a faster regeneration period."
The following statements are made by Ted concerning the abduction and murder of twenty-two year old Kathy Parks. Kathy was last seen on May 6, 1974 at Oregon State University. Her remains were discovered approximately a year later on the hillside of Taylor Mountain.]
"It was established quite early in the case that her body had been ravished by wildlife ... a whole variety of wild animals ... feed on the carcasses ... This might give us one as clue as to why this person returned to that site on at least several occasions . Perhaps it was discovered that when a body was left there, and later when the individual would return to check out the situation, he would find that it was no longer there!"
The following statements made by Ted are not relative to any one crime in particular.]
"Once he'd made his contact -- and it appeared he was going to be able to carry it through -- he became very calm and analytical about the situation he was in ... a period of relaxation ... until it came time for him to kill the victim ... he would become torn apart as to the correctness of his conduct ... he'd still have the overriding need to dispose of the victim, and, of course, once it was done, he would usually go into a state of panic. Suddenly it would seem as if the dominant, or formerly dominant ... the predominant, normal self came back into control in a horrifying way. Or one that is presented with ... conceived with panic and confusion ... Fear of being captured or discovered ... I would envision a continuation of this kind of collaboration ... between that one part of this person's self. Which demands certain gratification, and the more dominant, law-abiding, more ethical, rational, normal self -- which was sort of forced to become a party to this kind of conduct. Basically you might say there was a shared division of responsibility. This came as much from evolution as from conscious choice."
" ... this activity is just a small, small portion of what was predominantly a normal existence ... which continued to be a normal existence ... This person could still be very much in favor of law and order and the police ... and be very genuinely shocked by crime in the newspaper. And very much moved by people who suffered the death of a loved one. Complete, genuine responding in a normal fashion. Willing and able to help police. He would have a real feeling in those regards. Not out of a desire to protect or hide. These were just normal responses ... The uniqueness of the whole situation is how this condition pertained to such a narrow spectrum of activity. The inhibitions that would normally prevent a person from acting that way were specifically excised, removed, diminished, repressed ... in such a way as to not affect all the other inhibitions -- or to result in the deterioration off the entire personality. But only in that tiny, tiny slice!"
"We would expect that after the passing of a period of time, this psychological condition, or part of that individual's self ... would reach a state of maturity ... its growth would greatly diminish ... the normal self had a pretty good understanding of this condition. Learned, uh, how to tolerate it..And perhaps, as a symptom of this matured state of development of the condition ... we'd expect this individual wouldn't need to drink to over come his inhibitions."
"It's like trying to examine what's in the medical cabinet by, in great detail, examining what's in the mirror ... he wasn't seeing through perhaps, the morass of justifications and obfuscations that he'd created and indulged in -- and what he was closely examining was the reflection in the mirror, not what was behind it. Not what was really going on ... on the one hand he thought he'd looked at the problem and dealt with it."
Ted Bundy: How does a person . . . how does a soldier deal with war?
HA: Well, he has the justification built in, you see, there.
Ted Bundy: So does the mass murderer.
"I think that you could say that the influence of the person's family history was positive. But not positive enough -- not enduring, perhaps not strong enough to overcome the urges or compulsions that resulted ... in this instance, the influence of the family and the environment in which this person grew up were positive, but not so positive as to prepare this individual ... " "You take the individual we are talking about ... and then you subject him to stress. Stress happens to come randomly, but its effect on the personality is not random; it's specific. That results in a certain amount of chaos, confusion, and frustration. That person begins to seek out a target for his frustrations. The continued nature of this stress this person was under -- the nature of the flaw or weakness in his personality, together with other elements in the environment that offer him a logical target for his frustrations or escapes from reality -- yields the situation we're discussing ... There is no trigger, it is truly more sophisticated than that."
"I hate to use labels that are psychological or psychiatric because there are no stereotypes, and when you start to use those labels, you stop looking at the facts." "This condition is not immediately seen by the individual or identified as a serious problem. It sort of manifests itself in an interest concerning sexual behavior, as sexual images ... But this interest, for some unknown reason, becomes geared toward matters of a sexual nature that involves violence. I cannot emphasize enough the gradual development of this. It is not short term ... This is on a different level than this individual would deal with women every day, and not in the context of sexual condition, because that is over here someplace, like collecting stamps. He doesn't retain the taste of glue, so to speak, all day long. But in a broader, more abstract way, it begins to preoccupy him."
"He has no hatred for women; there is nothing in his background that happened that would indicate he has been abused by any females ... there is some kind of weakness that gives rise to this individual's interest in the kind of sexual activity involving violence that would gradually begin to absorb some of his fantasy ... he was not imagining himself actually doing these things, but he found gratification from reading about others so engaged. Eventually the interest would become so demanding toward new material that it could only be catered to by what he could find in the dirty book stores."
[Bundy described the part of "this personality" that found gratification in the thoughts, and later acts, of sexual violence as "the entity," "the disordered self," and "the malignancy." The schemes or ruses used for isolating and abducting his victims, were a result of fantasy, and attributed to the "Ted," or dominant part of the personality. The following are statements made by Ted in which he discusses the progressive pattern of sexual violence prior to the commission of murder.]
"Say he was walking down the street on one occasion, one evening, and just totally, by chance ... looked up into the window of a house and saw a woman undressing ... And he began, with some regularity, with increasing regularity, to, uh, canvass, as it were, the community he lived in. By peeping in windows, as it were, and watching a woman undress, or watching whatever could be seen, you know, during the evening, and approaching it almost like a project, throwing himself into it, literally for years ... These occasions when he when he would, uh, travel about the neighborhoods that adjoined his and search out candidates for ... search out places where ... he could see what he wanted to see ... more or less these occasions were dictated ... still being dictated by this person's normal life. So he wouldn't break a date or postpone an important, uh, event ... wouldn't rearrange his life ... to accommodate this, uh, indulgence in voyeuristic behavior ... He gained ... a great amount of gratification from it. And he became increasingly adept at it -- as anyone becomes adept at anything they do over and over and over again ... What began to happen was that ... important matters were not being rearranged or otherwise interfered with by this voyeuristic behavior, but with increasing regularity, things were postponed or otherwise rescheduled, to, uh, work around, uh, hours and hours spent on the street, at night and during the early morning hours."
" ... what's happening is that we're building up the condition ... and what may have been a predisposition for violence becomes a disposition. And as the condition develops and its purposes or its characteristics become more well defined, it begins to demand more time of the individual ... There's a certain amount of tension, uh, struggle, between the normal personality and this, this, uh, psychopathological, uh, entity ... The tension between normal individual, uh, normal consciousness of this individual and those demands being submitted to him via this competing ... this condition inside him seems to be competing for more attention ... And it's not an independent thing. One doesn't switch on and the other doesn't switch off. They're more or less active at the same time. Sometimes one is more active ... "
" ... a point would be reached where we'd had all of this, this reservoir of tension building. Building and building. Finally, inevitably, this force -- this entity -- would make a breakthrough ... Maybe not a major breakthrough, but a significant breakthrough would be achieved -- where the tension would be too great and the demands and expectations of this entity would reach a point where they just could not be controlled. And where the consequences would really be seen for the first time." " I think you could make a little more sense of it if you take into account the effect of alcohol. It's important ... When this person drank a good deal, his inhibitions were significantly diminished. He would find that his urge to engage in voyeuristic behavior on trips to the book store would become more prevalent, more urgent. On every occasion when he engaged in such behavior, he was intoxicated."
" ... On one particular evening, when he had been drinking a great deal ... and he was passing a bar, he saw a woman leaving the bar and walk up a fairly dark side street. And we'd say that for no ... the urge to do something to that person seized him -- in a way he'd never been affected before ... And it seized him strongly. And to the point where, uh, without giving a great deal of thought, he searched around for some instrumentality to uh, uh, attack this woman with. He found a piece of a two-by-four in a lot somewhere and proceeded to follow and track this girl ... and he reached the point where he was, uh, almost driven to do something -- there was really no control at this point ... the sort of revelation of that experience and the frenzied desire that seized him, uh, really seemed to usher in a new dimension to the, that part of himself that was obsessed with ... violence and women and sexual activity -- a composite kind of thing. Not terribly well defined, but more well defined as time went on."
"On succeeding evenings he began to, uh, scurry around this same neighborhood, obsessed with the image he'd seen on the evening before ... and on one particular occasion, he saw a woman park her car and walk up to her front door and fumble with her keys. He walked up behind her and struck her with a ... piece of wood that he was carrying. And she fell down and began screaming, and he panicked and ran. What he had done had ... purely terrified him ... The sobering effect of that was to ... for some time ... close up the cracks again. And not do anything. For the first time, he sat back and swore to himself that he wouldn't do something like that again ... or anything that would lead to it ... And he did everything he should have done. He stayed away from ... he did not go out at night. And when he was drinking, he stayed around friends. For a period of months, the enormity of what he did stuck with him, and he watched his behavior and reinforced the desire to overcome what he had begun to perceive were some problems that were probably more severe than he would have liked to believe they were ... within a matter of months ... the impact of this event lost its ... deterrent value. And within months he was back ... peeping in windows again and slipping into that old routine ... the repulsion began to recede ... something did stick with him. That was the incredible danger: by allowing himself to fall into spontaneous, unplanned acts of violence ... It took six months or so, until he back thinking of alternative means of engaging in similar activities, but not ... something that would be likely to result in apprehension."
"Then on another night he saw a woman walking home ... he followed her home ... Eventually, he created a plan where he would attack her in, in the house ... early one morning, uh, he sneaked into her house ... he jumped on the woman's bed and attempted to restrain her... all he succeeded in doing was waking her up, and, uh, causing her to panic and scream. He left very rapidly ... And then he was seized with the same kind of disgust, repulsion, and fear and wonder at why he was allowing himself to attempt such extraordinary violence ... But the significance ... was that while he did the same thing he did before -- stayed off the streets, vowed he'd never do it again and recognized the horror of what he'd done, and certainly was frightened by what he saw happening -- it only took him three months to get over it this time ... and then the next incident, he was over it in a month -- until it didn't take him any time at all to recover... "
"We are talking about anonymous, abstracted, living and breathing people ... but they were not known. To a point they were symbols, uh, but once a certain point in the encounter had been crossed, they ceased being individuals and became, uh, well you could say problems ... that's not the word either... that's when the rational self -- the normal self -- would surface and, and, react with fear and horror ... But, recognizing the state of affairs, would sort of conspire with this other part of himself to conceal the act. The survival took precedence over remorse ... the normal individual, began to condition mentally, out guilt out guilt; using a variety of mechanisms. Saying it was justifiable, it was, uh, acceptable, it was necessary, and on and on."
"He received no pleasure from harming or causing pain to the person he attacked. He received absolutely no gratification from causing pain and did everything possible, within reason -- considering the unreasonableness of the situation -- not to torture these individuals, at least not physically."
[The following are statements made by Ted concerning the abduction and murder of twenty-one year old college co-ed Lynda Healy, which occurred on January 31, 1974. Healy was vanish ed from the basement bedroom the home which she shared with several other students. More than year had passed before her remains were discovered, as were those of three other young women, scattered on the hillside of Taylor Mountain.]
" ... he checked out the house and found that the front door was open. He thought about it. What kind of opportunity that offered. And returned to the house later and entered the house ... Then he went around the house and found a particular door and opened -- really hit and miss. Not knowing who or what, not looking or anyone in particular ... that would be the opportunity. This was late at night. And presumably everyone would be asleep ... we know that sometime later the remains were found somewhere in the Cascades. So obviously she transported up there ... some place that was quiet and private. His home or some secluded area ... He would have the girl undress and then, with that part of himself gratified, he found himself in a position where he realized then he couldn't let the girl go. And at that point he would kill her and leave her body where he had taken her."
"As far as remorse over the act, that would last for a period of time. But it could all be justified. The person would attempt to justify it by saying, "Well, listen you, you fucked up this time, but you're never going to do it again. So let's just stay together, and it won't ever happen again." Why sacrifice this person's whole life ... But this did not last for very long. A matter of weeks. We go first into a state of semi-dormancy, and then it would sort of regenerate itself, in one form or another ... Once the condition began to reassert its force, it didn't look back. It looked forward. Didn't want to dwell on the preceding event, but begin to plan, anticipate, contemplate the next ... things would be learned. Experience teaches in overt and subtle ways. And over a period of time, there would be less panic, there would be less confusion, there would be less fear and apprehension. There would be a faster regeneration period."
The following statements are made by Ted concerning the abduction and murder of twenty-two year old Kathy Parks. Kathy was last seen on May 6, 1974 at Oregon State University. Her remains were discovered approximately a year later on the hillside of Taylor Mountain.]
"It was established quite early in the case that her body had been ravished by wildlife ... a whole variety of wild animals ... feed on the carcasses ... This might give us one as clue as to why this person returned to that site on at least several occasions . Perhaps it was discovered that when a body was left there, and later when the individual would return to check out the situation, he would find that it was no longer there!"
The following statements made by Ted are not relative to any one crime in particular.]
"Once he'd made his contact -- and it appeared he was going to be able to carry it through -- he became very calm and analytical about the situation he was in ... a period of relaxation ... until it came time for him to kill the victim ... he would become torn apart as to the correctness of his conduct ... he'd still have the overriding need to dispose of the victim, and, of course, once it was done, he would usually go into a state of panic. Suddenly it would seem as if the dominant, or formerly dominant ... the predominant, normal self came back into control in a horrifying way. Or one that is presented with ... conceived with panic and confusion ... Fear of being captured or discovered ... I would envision a continuation of this kind of collaboration ... between that one part of this person's self. Which demands certain gratification, and the more dominant, law-abiding, more ethical, rational, normal self -- which was sort of forced to become a party to this kind of conduct. Basically you might say there was a shared division of responsibility. This came as much from evolution as from conscious choice."
" ... this activity is just a small, small portion of what was predominantly a normal existence ... which continued to be a normal existence ... This person could still be very much in favor of law and order and the police ... and be very genuinely shocked by crime in the newspaper. And very much moved by people who suffered the death of a loved one. Complete, genuine responding in a normal fashion. Willing and able to help police. He would have a real feeling in those regards. Not out of a desire to protect or hide. These were just normal responses ... The uniqueness of the whole situation is how this condition pertained to such a narrow spectrum of activity. The inhibitions that would normally prevent a person from acting that way were specifically excised, removed, diminished, repressed ... in such a way as to not affect all the other inhibitions -- or to result in the deterioration off the entire personality. But only in that tiny, tiny slice!"
"We would expect that after the passing of a period of time, this psychological condition, or part of that individual's self ... would reach a state of maturity ... its growth would greatly diminish ... the normal self had a pretty good understanding of this condition. Learned, uh, how to tolerate it..And perhaps, as a symptom of this matured state of development of the condition ... we'd expect this individual wouldn't need to drink to over come his inhibitions."
"It's like trying to examine what's in the medical cabinet by, in great detail, examining what's in the mirror ... he wasn't seeing through perhaps, the morass of justifications and obfuscations that he'd created and indulged in -- and what he was closely examining was the reflection in the mirror, not what was behind it. Not what was really going on ... on the one hand he thought he'd looked at the problem and dealt with it."
Ted Bundy: How does a person . . . how does a soldier deal with war?
HA: Well, he has the justification built in, you see, there.
Ted Bundy: So does the mass murderer.